DW 604 The Doctor's Wife--Reaction Post

[amberfocus]

Wow, my f-list really seems to be split on this episode.  I almost feel guilty for enjoying it so much.  This episode finally felt like Doctor Who again to me.  Maybe not RTD Who, but definitely old time Who.  However, I really wish Eleven would stop saying things are impossible, because clearly they're not or they wouldn't keep happening.

I really enjoyed the TARDIS being put into a body, even though I don't like how the woman had to be murdered to house the TARDIS soul.  Even if it was done by the bad guy.  I liked how quirky and fun the human!TARDIS was.  I love that she considered the truth to be that she stole a Time Lord even if he thought he stole her.  Kindred spirits, those two, the Doctor and his TARDIS.  It did make me think a bit more about how much of Bad Wolf/Rose/TARDIS combination was TARDIS though.  I remember the first time I watched that I thought it was the TARDIS, even more than Rose, who wanted her Doctor to be safe.  Rose was simply the device used to save him.  On rewatches I tended to go a bit more shippy thinking it was more Rose than TARDIS.  But now it is all up in the air again.  Though I would like to know why Idris' body didn't start to burn up holding the TARDIS within it when Rose barely lasted ten minutes and that was starting with a healthy body.

I don't know, there's always so many holes to step around in any recent DW plot, so I kind of just...did that for this episode.  I loved the relationship between the Doctor and the TARDIS, seeing her able to talk and reciprocate feelings and shout back at him.  I loved how much emotion Eleven showed, how he was falling apart at the end.  It was nice to see that there was still a bit of Nine and Ten in there somewhere.  I felt more like he was the Doctor in this episode.  I think the last time I felt he was somewhere mid-season five and then it went away again.

House was very creepy though and I didn't like what he put Amy and Rory through.  I mean, I liked it, just not the emotional wringer they had.  And is every episode going to kill off Rory and bring him back?  I thought eye patch lady was going to be the new crack, but now I'm thinking maybe it's just killing Rory.

I adored that the TARDIS thought Rory was the pretty one instead of Amy!  That made me laugh out loud.  I thought it was hilarious that Amy and Rory asked that their new bedroom (ha! there are bedrooms on the TARDIS!) not have bunk beds.  And I liked Rory asking the Doctor if he had a bedroom.  Of course it wasn't answered, but I like that he asked it.  Also loved Eleven swinging on the cables under the console while he fixed things.  It was like his only way of being close to the TARDIS again.

All in all it was a fun, silly romp, and that's what I miss most in Moffat's Who.  I hope Neil Gaiman writes for Who again.  I'd only read his collaboration with Terry Pratchett, Good Omens, which I liked a lot and Neverwhere, which I enjoyed less, so I wasn't really sure what to expect.  I think maybe something darker than what we got.  I was glad for the lighthearted moments interspersed with House trying to kill Amy and Rory.  It was a good mix and I'd like to see it again.

Comments

LOVED LOVED LOVED this ep

[london susannah (from livejournal.com)]

*waves* Hi. First time commenter... Long time reader. (just a couple months, really. Very much enjoying your writing!)

Oh how I agree with you about feeling like DW is BACK. And oh how adored the human TARDIS and her interaction with the Doctor -- and the Doctor's reactions when introducing her to Rory and Amy.

I couldn't help but think several times during this ep -- Neil Gaiman is SUCH a fanboy, and oh my is he giving all kinds of great stuff to the DW FF writers to work with!

Re: LOVED LOVED LOVED this ep

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Hello and welcome! *smiles* Yeah, I think his fanboyishness came shining through. It reminded me just a little bit of how RTD wrote an episode, and if there's one thing you can say about Gaiman, it's that he knows how to do character development.

[mkejenkins.livejournal.com]

I have to agree that this one was a bit of fun. I don't think I'll ever be a big fan of Eleven but seeing the relationship between the Doctor and Idris/TARDIS was really fascinating and fun to watch for a change. It was a very interesting take on the most lasting relationship in the Doctor's lives. I too would love to see more like this from Neil Gaiman.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Yes, and fun has been sorely lacking (or maybe it's just a sense of humor) since the Moff took over. I felt more like this ep was having fun as opposed to the poking fun that Moff is constantly doing. I would gladly hand the show over to NG if he'd take it.

[amyo67.livejournal.com]

I agree.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

:) :) :)

[kilodalton]

Though I would like to know why Idris' body didn't start to burn up holding the TARDIS within it when Rose barely lasted ten minutes and that was starting with a healthy body.

I guess technically Rose held the time VORTEX, and the dialogue for TDW said that Idris held the tardis MATRIX - so, they were holding different things. Which I guess makes sense in that Idris couldn't just dissolve the House into dust or w/e like Rose did in PoTW.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

It's all swirly gold bits to me. *laughs* Yeah, I guess Rose had the heart of the TARDIS and Idris had the soul of the TARDIS. Although it felt more like the brain/mind than the soul. Although the soul is seated in the mind so I guess it makes sense.

[lorelaisquared.livejournal.com]

Don't feel guilty for liking it! It was a fantastic episode and whether everyone on your flist agrees or not isn't important - everyone will react in a different way.

I loved it also - It reminded me of why I loved this show so much in the first place - it made me squee and flail a lot and I throughly enjoyed the reactions between the Doctor and TARDIS. I really wish we could see more of that.

Interesting point about Rose/Bad Wolf. I kinda wanna watch the end of S1 again to see if this new knowledge changes how I look at some of the events in those episodes.

I was thinking that Rory dying-but-not is definitely becoming a theme this series. So much so that I'm starting to wonder if it's actually going to end up being incredibly important instead of just a kind of running joke. If Moffat can somehow pull it off it could be rather spectacular.

[yavie-namarie.livejournal.com]

I hope it's not the running joke...
Although, it's kind of amusing drawing parallels between Rory and Daniel Jackson from Stargate SG-1... XD

[yavie-namarie.livejournal.com]

Oh wow, I'm SO looking forward to watching this even more than before (if that's even possible...).

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

*grins*

Oh, and thanks by the way for the link to that thing on kids bullying other kids and allergies. Found it quite interesting.

[londoca.livejournal.com]

It was a great episode. Dont feel guilty. I loved old Who before RTD. I think the TARDIS wanted her Dr safe as well as Rose. They became one to have the same goal.

But I think now the TARDIS gave Rose Ten 2 in Thanks. Your Dr and my Dr but both the Dr

Idris was built from Time Lord spare parts. Lived about as long as 9 did with the vortex.

[kilodalton]

But I think now the TARDIS gave Rose Ten 2 in Thanks. Your Dr and my Dr but both the Dr

This is a really interesting point! The TARDIS did lock Donna in during JE so that TenToo could be created ....


Idris was built from Time Lord spare parts. Lived about as long as 9 did with the vortex.

Good point as well!

[azriona.livejournal.com]

WHO DOESN'T LIKE THIS EPISODE?????? POINT ME AT THEM AND I WILL DENY THEM BROWNIES.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

No brownies is a fate worse than death. Almost.

ohhhh

[othermewriter.livejournal.com]

I just realized as I re-watched the episode what they may be doing! River's consciousness gets transfered into the Cal Matrix, but what if it was then transfered into the TARDIS? Thus bringing the TARDIS to life. OOOO what a timey wimey that would make and would explain why the TARDIS suddenly started responding to the Doctor snapping his fingers. Hmmmmm interesting idea. Wonder if I got this one figured out, it would explain a lot of things.

Re: ohhhh

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

It's definitely an interesting theory.

[susanb03.livejournal.com]

We WANT more Neil Gaiman!!!!

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Definitely.

[mylittlepwny.livejournal.com]

I remember the first time I watched that I thought it was the TARDIS, even more than Rose, who wanted her Doctor to be safe. Rose was simply the device used to save him. On rewatches I tended to go a bit more shippy thinking it was more Rose than TARDIS. But now it is all up in the air again.

But see, I always go back to the same thing when this is brought up: it just wasn't the TARDIS that Rose took into her. Though, yeah, she took it from inside the TARDIS, it was Rose's deepest desire, deepest need for the Doctor to be saved that put it all into action and led to Bad Wolf. She sat in that chip shop with her mum and Mickey and wasn't upset that he sent her away from the action; she was heartbroken and furious that he was dying and she couldn't do a thing about it, and then she connects everything with that clever mind of hers and goes about putting this to rights. And when she looks down at him and tells him just that, the shine of time is gone from her eyes, did you notice? That's Rose, right there. Looking down at her Doctor, taking in the time vortex just to keep him whole.

I didn't really argue that very well lol BUT I SWEAR IF RTD WAS ASKED THIS IS WHAT HE WOULD SAY TOO. I JUST KNOW IT.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I suppose that is true. She really did desperately want to get back to him (and who could blame her?). I'd forgotten the bit about her eyes not having the shiny gold when she said that. It's been a while since I've watched that ep as it always just breaks my heart losing Nine so soon . I'll have to watch it again soon on a day that I don't mind crying my eyes out..

[emraldeyedauter.livejournal.com]

I love, love love this episode. It was fanfic come true in so many ways with the beautiful TARDIS in the being of a human body. The title was perfect and this was Doctor Who at its finest. I started crying the minute I saw the coral console because of the wonderful memories of Seasons one to four but also when Eleven was crying. Damn crying doctors always makeme cry too. Finally finally we have a Season with Eleven where the writers can really give Matt the chance to shine.

[who-in-whoville.livejournal.com]

I was so sad that the TARDIS had to delete 9 and 10's console room :(

[http://users.livejournal.com/_thirty2flavors/]

Hmm are there lots of mixed reviews? I've almost exclusively seen positive stuff, but then I've been kind of avoiding negative stuff because I just want to revel in my utter delight witht his episode for the moment. It's been a long time since I've felt defensive enough of an episode to want to do that! Hurrah!

The TARDIS/Bad Wolf shenanigans, IDK, I never really understood that argument in the first place. My reading has always been that Bad Wolf is a bit of a Rose/TARDIS hybrid, but more like a goddess version of Rose than a human version of the TARDIS. And, well, now we've seen a human version of the TARDIS, and it was nothing like Bad Wolf. I've always figured it was Rose who wanted the Doctor safe, just like it was Rose who killed the Daleks and Rose who brought Jack back permanently because she's "so human". Most of the time when I see people arguing otherwise it's just a way to discredit Rose because they hate her, so I've never given it any thought.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Well, when I wrote this my f-list was about half and half. Now it's more like 10% disapproving and 90% approving. A couple of people have even flounced over it, which makes me sad as I was really encouraged by this episode that things were going to get better.

My thoughts on Bad Wolf/Rose/TARDIS were really my initial impression my first time through when I wasn't really watching with a shipper's eye. By the time I had watched series one a second time I'd gone to total shipper mode, so by then my viewpoint had totally shifted. I definitely always thought Rose was responsible for Jack, but I think the TARDIS had a hand in the killing of the Daleks because they had wiped out her people as well as the Time Lords (even if tecnically the Doctor did do that, we didn't really know the extent of it back then).

I will never understand why anyone could hate Rose. The character is just so interesting and multi-dimensional.

[apurplepatch.livejournal.com]

First episode I've wholeheartedly enjoyed since Ten/Tennant/RTD left...

I still have questions, and things but I'd happily sit down and rewatch it again whereas I don't have any urge to watch any of the Season 5 or Season 6 episodes shown prior to this again.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Well, I quite liked most of Eleven's first episode last season, but a huge amount of that is Amelia. But this one is far and away the best of Eleven's tenure so far and I'm sure it all comes down to the writing.

[who-in-whoville.livejournal.com]

For the first time since End of TIme, I loved the Doctor. Truly loved the Doctor. I've sort of tolerated 11 up until now (well, a little better than tolerated, but definitely not love.

First reaction, Moffat, hire Neil Gaiman permanently.

My little Doctor/Rose shippery heart couldn't help but beat out of control (I have a one track mind). First of all I completely agree with the comments below that the TARDIS facilitated the creation of 10.5. But what about the common belief amongst us Doctor/Rose girls that she aided in the regeneration of 9 into 10 as well....he was in Rose's mind, of course. I believe that's a given as well. (Even wrote a ficlet to that effect -- "Tailor Made")

Now the TARDIS has been in TWO people. So why not in River? Or perhaps she's an actual personification of the TARDIS from the future? What about the fact that River moves BACKWARDS in time? Seems like a being of time would be the only one who could do that... then there's the whole obvious "the only water in the forest is the river" line... (not that I am a River fan...just sayin'...)

Anyway, good to see you smiling about this epi, amberfocus :)

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

It really was just a delightful episode all around.

I've still got mixed feelings about River, but I do like her. She's gotten more and more amusing and engaging and at least Alex Kingston has great chemistry with Matt Smith because it really wasn't there with David.

I'd never really thought aboout her aiding in the regeneration of Nine to Ten. I always kind of thought it was the Doctor imprinting on Rose, trying to make himself the perfect pretty boy for Rose so her eyes wouldn't go straying off onto other men. Of course then his went straying off, the git.

I really don't want River to be the TARDIS, but I am curious to find out who she really is, if they ever tell us.

[rallalon.livejournal.com]

Gotta say, this is the first time in a long while that I've watched a new episode of Who and been elated. I fully agree on him being the Doctor in this episode. Generally, when he's The Doctor nowadays, he has to go off and be a jackass immediately after, which is like showing me cake and then throwing it on the floor, frosting down. Here, no. Doctor all the way. There were some little bits where it was just a slight bit off ("Another Ood I failed to save" felt like something that just got tacked on), but they were so infrequent that, looking back and trying, yeah, I can only remember the Ood one.

More than just the Doctor, we also got bits of other Time Lords! I mean, we only saw part of the arm, but still. For a moment, there was hope. Not only that, but it was given in such Who Science that it wasn't even that ridiculous of a notion. The reality was very Brain of Morbius, to my mind, but I suppose that's partially because all of the TARDIS's ramblings ("Do fish have fingers?") reminded me a lot of Four ("Why is a mouse when it spins?") and it put my brain in that space. Also, well, patchwork minions + arm.

The use of a human TARDIS could have gone awry so very quickly and the level of delight I have at her confusion at tenses and such is pretty ridiculous. Such wonder going on. The way she prodded her own face in the mirror reminded me so much of the beginnings of Three, flicking his eyebrows around and annoying the Brig. Fantastic.

Also on the Rory-killing, it's getting just a lot over-used. I mean, it happened multiple times last season, too. The dream world, the crack, etc. He's good for other things, I should hope. Really getting tired of suspending my disbelief there and I hope they bring back eye patch lady soon.

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Ooh, The Brain of Morbius. I haven't thought about that one in a long time, but I can definitely see a bit of similarity there.

Yes, this episode was just a delight through and through and it was so nice to see the Doctor acting like the Doctor should act without then being a git afterwards like he almost always is these days. Those little Time Lord distress call boxes about broke my heart! Even if it was a moment of hope thinking maybe there were some other Time Lords out there (besides the little girl that regnerated).

I thought they did human!TARDIS very, very well. The actress was wonderful and just so much fun. The whole episode was fun in a way it just hasn't been in so, so long.

Okay, I've been refraining from bugging you about a certain fic for a long time now, but since you are here, *grins*, will there by chance be an update to the lovely In Human Hands soon?

[tardisblue.livejournal.com]

I totally loved it. I think this is the first 11th Doctor episode that I really, really enjoyed - I don't think I've really been feeling it until this episode!

Loved the Tardis's personality!

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

It's like the Doctor finally came into his personality the way he should have a long time ago! And the TARDIS was just an all around delight.

[lit-wolf.livejournal.com]

All my friends and I gave this episode two thumbs up! I didn't realize there are some who didn't like it.

I agree with everything, epescially with how awesome the human!TARDIS was. Calling the Doctor 'her thief' was adorable!

[amberfocus.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I loved that. "Thief, Thief. Where's my Thief?" *laughs*

[shadowchsr79.livejournal.com]

this was a very fun episode. I think aside from the killing of Rory, which is turning into a running gag, the funniest part for me was when Amy meets the human Tardis, see's the doctor's reaction and asks him if he "wished for this really really hard." So she knows shes rather infatuated with his ship. And as for why Rose didn't last that long with the tardis soul inside her, i'm asuming it's because she had her own soul and life force of her own that was fighting for space within her body. Her body probably wouldn't have died right away but her mind with her exsisting consiousness would burn out faster because there is more than one. In this show the other person killed so there would be an empty body for the Tardis soul to inhabit.

[develish1]

I'm still ploughing through my f-list as I was away for most of last week, so I'm very behind, but what I've read so far all seems to be very much in favour of the ep.

Personally, it was the probably the only ep other than "Vincent" that I actually will rewatch, and where I didn't spend the whole ep picking fault with it.

On the down side, I'm now dreading heading back into Moff's head even more, because this finally felt like DW again to me *sigh*

[venus-whovian-9.livejournal.com]

I have a theory of why Idirs lasted longer than Rose.The House used previous Time Lords to put together Auntie and Uncle.I'll assume he did the same with Idris.So,having bits from Time Ladies' bodies would probably be an advantage and wouldn't burn the body up,whilst Rose was pure Human.
And sure as Hell,I loved the old console room showing up in this episode!
(Being from Greece,we don't see season 6 and I only recently bumped into a group with links on the episodes-hence I leave a comment now.)